All four main parties in Wales can claim credit for devolution, says new book

Martin Shipton

All four main parties in Wales share the credit for Welsh devolution, according to the authors of a new book which seeks to unravel what they increasingly found to be a complicated story.

Alun Gibbard said: “We first collaborated on a Welsh language book called Gwynoro and Gwynfor [Gwynoro and Gwynfor] which was about the very personal battle between Gwynoro Jones and Gwynfor Evans in the Carmarthen constituency.

“That was personified by these two very strong individuals.They fought each other politically. They didn’t get on very well as individuals.

“Not only did you have the battle between the two individuals, which was quite intense and quite fraught, but that personified the broader battle between Labour and Plaid Cymru in the most bitter period in Welsh politics.

“The original plan was to bring out the book in English, but then we realised that the story was taking on a life of its own.

“It changed from the two individuals to the two parties, and from the two parties we extended it to every party that had been involved in devolution, not just in Carmarthen at that period, but from 1880 to the present day.”

Compendium

Gwynoro Jones, who was Labour MP for Carmarthen from 1970 to 1974, said: “The battle between the two parties was about who represented Wales – who spoke up for Wales most? Was it Plaid Cymru, since the days of [co-founder] Saunders Lewis, or was it the Labour Party of Jim Griffiths and all that?

“A lot has been written about devolution, but there wasn’t a compendium of the whole period. You’ve got plenty of books about Welsh nationalism and devolution, but what is the actual story?

“We had to go back to the 1880s – to the days of Michael D Jones [leader of the Welsh who emigrated to Patagonia] to the days of Cymru Fydd [literally ‘Wales to come’, a proto-nationalist movement from the late 19th century that included the young David Lloyd George ], then on to Keir Hardie [the early Labour leader who advocated home rule for Wales].

“We thought we’d finish around 1980 – 100 years – but as we were writing the book, the whole issue of what was happening to the Senedd flared up.

“Boris Johnson was trying to dismantle the devolution settlement. So we thought there would have to be two or three chapters in the book about what happened after the 1979 referendum [when plans to set up a Welsh Assembly were defeated by four to one].

“Who can claim they were part of that story? Four parties have played their part.”

Gibbard said :”At different times, different parties have taken over. There have been overlaps. At the time we were putting the book together, there was the whole thing about the Assembly celebrating 20 years.

“We saw a few comments saying that Welsh politics was celebrating its 20th anniversary. Whoa – hang on! Welsh politics wasn’t celebrating 20 years. You could go back further than 1880.”

Jones said: “The whole issue of home rule goes back to the 1880s.We’re arguing about it now, but they were debating it back then.

“Another thing about the book for me was wanting to stop this nonsense that it’s all going to happen so quickly. Every few months, Gwynfor used to suggest that a Welsh state would be around the corner in three years’ ’time. He won [Carmarthen] in 1966, lost it in 1970 and then came back in 1974. It was only a matter of time now and there would be a Welsh state.

“Increasingly there is that thing with Plaid Cymru that wants you to believe that it’s quite easy to achieve. But it’s going to take possibly decades again. Yes Cymru doesn’t believe that – Adam Price doesn’t believe that – he talks of 10 years ’time.”

Independence

Jones pointed out that Saunders Lewis and Gwynfor Evans had never used the word “independence”.

Gibbard said: ”In terms of devolution, you’ve got a contribution from all four political parties in Wales over a period of time – but then on another level there’s the fact that there were deep divisions within those political parties.”

Jones said: ”The book reveals that Wales is very divided on how it should be governed. This goes back more than 100 years. Lloyd George thought he would get home rule. He was shouted down by the Liberals and he was hounded out of Newport at a public meeting. From there he forgot about the whole idea of home rule.

“The Labour Party believed in home rule under Keir Hardie and it was Labour Party policy until 1945.”

Gibbard said: ”If you add to that [Merthyr Tydfil Labour MP} SO Davies’ Parliament for Wales petition in the 1950s, which attracted the signatures of 250,000 people – that was huge. Compare that to the 18,000 members of Yes Cymru at its height.”

Jones said: “That’s the period when I first became politically aware. I was 13 in the mid-1950s.

“A quarter of a million signatures at a time when there was no social media and not even many telephones in Wales.

“Elystan Morgan [a former Plaid Cymru member who joined Labour and became an MP] told me he realised that in essence Plaid Cymru was a pressure group and not a genuine political party.

“He kept on telling me that what Wales needed was the organisation and support of the loyalty Labour has in Wales combined with the enthusiasm and patriotism of Plaid Cymru.

“Somehow those two parties have got to find some common ground somewhere. And it’s proving difficult.”

Whose Wales? The Battle for Welsh Devolution and Nationhood 1880-2020 by Alun Gibbard and Gwynoro Jones is published by Parthian Books at £14.99,

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